Author Topic: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2  (Read 2374 times)

Delta

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New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« on: February 08, 2014, 02:10:14 PM »
I play the D2 Hell Unleashed Mod a lot. Some people loyal to that mod are looking at TL2 Synergies as the next possible alternative. I think synergies is a great improvement over vanilla tl2. My hat goes off to you Salan for all your work on this. I think creating some classes such as in the Diablo 2 series would do a lot to lure people over. I do think your mod needs to have tougher/longer boss fights and more herds of enemies throughout the levels. Something that encourages the coop play is one thing that makes Hell Unleashed special. I think adding rolling resists to bosses and or faster heal timers will encourage this. I also think there should be more types of enemies rather than the regular ones for certain areas. For example in frosted hills still having enemies that use fire, or lightning elementals will encourage people to better balance their chars and reinforce coop play. Just some suggestions, but again I thank you for all your work thus far.

-Delta

potterman28wxcv

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2014, 03:01:00 PM »
Yeah, playing on health regen and/or partial immunities would bring some challenge for sure !  :)  Considering balancing is a very hard work, Salan has already done something great. About D2 classes, I don't really agree, because it has to still in the Torchlight universe..

What would be fun (i'm starting to be out of the initial topic but anyway) would be an area where you could "travel back in time" and come back to the Torchlight 1 quests : you would have the Torchlight 1 bosses to kill. Still it would need a lot of work.

Salan

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2014, 04:13:50 PM »
I talk to soulmancer on steam, we actually live really close to each other (travelling within a few km of each other once in a while) and have discussed modding Tl2 more then a few times.

One of the goals I had with synergies was to make boss fights last longer.  I truly dislike the 20 second fights, and utterly hate anything less.  I want the fights to last a minute, or more.  Obviously to do that you need to make it not artificial and boring.  MIN/MAX'rs will always destroy your best laid plans but the general playerbase will usually fall into the middle range. 

I found with the executioner fight that I could make even the best min/maxer take a while to kill a boss, the problem with that is the lower end take endless amount of time or are unable to do it..  Its a tuff thing to get right.

on the idea of the damage resistances I will be putting this into the elemental crypt as a first test... fire elementals that are immune to fire but take more cold damage, for instance.. we'll see how people react to this first.
People motivate themselves, and are inspired by others.
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**more awesome then an awesome possum**

potterman28wxcv

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2014, 06:04:44 PM »
Immunity would be too punishive. But 50% resistant while taking 50% more damage from another element, may be ok ; to be tested.

Salan

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2014, 06:54:47 PM »
;)
People motivate themselves, and are inspired by others.
--- I love making FUN encounters, the ones that make you scream with terror, and remember them forever! ---
**more awesome then an awesome possum**

Delta

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2014, 04:47:55 PM »
Thats very cool that you and Mancer talk on Steam. I was hoping he would mod tl2, but you have laid a lot of ground work for it which would be amazing if you guys put your heads together on it! The reason I state a rolling resist for example in the latest patch of HU, Baals resists roll from elemental to elemental. So for example 2 seconds he pois immune (but not immune, regular resists to the other elementals) then the next 2 seconds he is fire immune (but all other elemental resists go do normal amount). This way one type of build can kill without cooperation from others.

I know Mods always have a challenge trying to find the right mix of difficulty for the masses. But I honestly feel that those that want it easier, in the long run wont stick around anyways, no matter how many changes you make. But if you make it more difficult obviously the mod wont have as many players, but the players that really find it a challenge will stick around and be much more loyal to the mod over the long run. Plus with TL2 you have 3 different difficulties plus a HC mode which can make it much more versatile in appealing to players difficulty comfort.

Either way, Great Mod so far. 3 of us from HU are playing now through. Thanks again.

Sincerely,
Delta

Salan

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2014, 05:10:37 PM »
Thats very cool that you and Mancer talk on Steam. I was hoping he would mod tl2, but you have laid a lot of ground work for it which would be amazing if you guys put your heads together on it! The reason I state a rolling resist for example in the latest patch of HU, Baals resists roll from elemental to elemental. So for example 2 seconds he pois immune (but not immune, regular resists to the other elementals) then the next 2 seconds he is fire immune (but all other elemental resists go do normal amount). This way one type of build can kill without cooperation from others.


this is possible

Quote
I know Mods always have a challenge trying to find the right mix of difficulty for the masses. But I honestly feel that those that want it easier, in the long run wont stick around anyways, no matter how many changes you make. But if you make it more difficult obviously the mod wont have as many players, but the players that really find it a challenge will stick around and be much more loyal to the mod over the long run. Plus with TL2 you have 3 different difficulties plus a HC mode which can make it much more versatile in appealing to players difficulty comfort.

Either way, Great Mod so far. 3 of us from HU are playing now through. Thanks again.

Sincerely,
Delta

Ya when it is easy I tend to get bored a lot earlier in most cases... there is no fullfillment in something being handed to you.
People motivate themselves, and are inspired by others.
--- I love making FUN encounters, the ones that make you scream with terror, and remember them forever! ---
**more awesome then an awesome possum**

wolfs

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2014, 03:33:12 PM »
Ill add my 2cents regarding the fight mechanics and other stuff now that HU was mentioned....

I have a berzerker, so far, the only boss that was able to kill him was the a1 grand regent, first time around lvl 22 and the second around lvl 65.

Why? because the regent has a good skill rotation , and has a skill that can simply K.O. and Delta can relate also to this, if you dont know how to fight him as a melee, you will more likely get killed. Most bosses barely scratch my zerker or dont even hurt him, and with 13k HP the zerker got 1shotted by Regent because I got distracted for a moment.

So his mechanic its kind of Hit, hit, hit, move or you die, - he teleports - chase him and deal with mobs/attacks while u do it, hit, hit, hit, and repeat.  The bad thing is that his life bulb sucks and his other attacks deal lame dmg, but mechanic is good.

His fight and all boss fights could be improved by adding a rotating elemental resist,(like HU baal) also, add a missiles reflect skills to his rotation of attacks, so not only melee get to not hurt him every now and then and ranged char dont just stand behind and snipe.

The other thing, there is nothing wrong about big life bulbs, bosses that alive longer, get to hurt you more or use all their skill scheme. When the 3 of us get togheter, Delta, chris and I, its just a blink. (Note we went the vanilla path, just using what we get thru storyline), When playing elite, we expect long fight and hard stuff, I dont mind taking 5-10 mins in a solo boss fight (or even MP) and using 30 juvs and like 50 red pots if i know i have a low dps and playing elite... If its too hard might just play Veteran or normal... Thats the whole point of elite, the hardest difficulty and the point also of having different difficulties.


Talking about other stuff, Potter mentioned about teleporting to Tl1 area and fight the bosses a time travel kind of thing.
This is a neat Idea, and also an idea I personally bumped in HU (traveling to D1 dungeon), but its kind of impossible since a limited number of maps in D2 and HU its almost full already. Just like an specific dungeon map, its doable and should be fun, i bump this idea.

Other questions since im not fully soaked with synergies info...
-Are there dungeons actually with specific items u get only there?
-to Salan: Do you accept help/suggestions regarding balancing of items? Because most of uniques are useless or junk, and also, even when we know you are busy, still could get help on this get a list of proposed changes and let that sit until you have time to implement. the changes.
-If we manage to get a complete class info, say, we suggest making a basic D2 necromancer or druid BY EXAMPLE (as delta suggested D2 classes), and provide the entire information and numbers, tiers of the skills and everything, would you take a look on it and maybe try and implement?

Salutes ;)

EdnaHall

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Re: New Classes modeling after Diablo 2
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2016, 05:59:11 AM »
 I think creating some classes such as in the Diablo 2 series would do a lot to lure people over. I do think your mod needs to have tougher/longer boss fights and more herds of enemies throughout the levels. Something that encourages the coop play is one thing that makes Hell Unleashed special.???
== Solitaire ==