Author Topic: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod  (Read 1149 times)

arobi

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Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« on: October 28, 2015, 12:27:09 PM »
I just uploaded my first mod. The goal is to better balance the Outlander and Ember Mage for Synergies. The changes are relatively small as to not overdue it.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=543457027

The changes that this mod makes:
Outlander:
Glaive Throw:
  • Adds 10% weapon DPS at tier 1
  • Adds 25% weapon DPS at tier 2
  • Adds 50% weapon DPS at tier 3

Exploding Glaive:
Adds 1% weapon DPS per level

Venomous Hail:
Allows use of a wand as well

Ember Mage:
Frost Wave:
Adds flat 20% weapon DPS to all skill levels

Prismatic Bolt:
  • Adds 5% weapon DPS at tier 1
  • Adds 10% weapon DPS at tier 2
  • Adds 15% weapon DPS at tier 3
« Last Edit: October 28, 2015, 06:39:43 PM by arobi »

potterman28wxcv

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Re: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2015, 05:44:12 PM »
Yes, that's a very good idea to add weapon dps to skill damage ! Keep it up  ;D

arobi

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Re: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2015, 01:02:51 AM »
Thanks for the feedback. I'm trying out an outlander with both glaive's maximized. I'm using the Holy Angelic set mostly and have a bunch of +40% damage skulls. The damage is basically nothing in DF. The troll king barely is touched even for the venomous hail. This is even on veteran difficulty.

I'm thinking that the outlander needs much more than just 50% WDPS on the glaive and 15% on the shattering glaive. The problem is that if I give too much benefit, then pre-DF gets too easy. Obviously the berserker wolf-pack can be used to great affect, but I'm not seeing much the outlander can do. I consoled up a full Prophesied Eclipse and got 16 DR enhancements, 8 crit chance and the rest in crit damage. I socketed almost all str & focus skulls (+235 STR, +40 dex, +40 vit and +955 focus). I had a wand equipped and a shield (not the best, but 1k DPS on the wand). With this, the character is useless outside of God mode (just barely over 3000 HP in DF), but it finally could do some damage to the troll king. The shattering glaive was doing about 100k on crits and the thrown glaive was about 55k (doing 150-300k to normal DF guys). Obviously not ideal and not a feasible build. The damage is there, but only with obscene focus.

Since the Outlander has no good way of lowering DR or applied DoT very fast other than the V.Hail, I'm still not thinking the class is up to snuff for DF. DF bosses are just insanely difficult for this class.

Any opinions on a tactic to get this class more on par with a berserker/warlock for DF without unbalancing the class for leveling? I could buff the Glaive throw by more than 50% WDPS which wouldn't make it more powerful than a wolfpack, but it would be pretty strong. I'd hate to buff the shattering glaive too much as it is an odd skill to buff with WDPS at all (since much of the damage is splash and from the fire, not the initial hit, so adding too much WDPS will definitely unbalance it for leveling).

Thoughts?

potterman28wxcv

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Re: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2015, 08:21:58 AM »
In my opinion it is impossible to balance a class both for leveling and T1 content just using skills.

This balance should be achieved by items : when you have a full Tier 0 set with enough sockets, you should be able to beat Tier 1, regardless of your skills (assuming you did not struggle too much in Tier 0)

The major problem right now in Synergies is that this is not true - you need to do a lot of farming before you can get the Tier 1 items from the trash mobs, and only then you can try to beat some bosses. Try, not succeed, because some classes are more advantaged than others..

If you ask me, Synergies is good until the Trolls - then, you need to grind a damn lot, and even then you're not even sure to succeed depending on your class.
 
In my opinion, Tier 1 needs a major rework regarding balance. But it's a lot of work, one would need to be very dedicated to it to achieve this.

However, back to the skills, the synergies between skills and items could be improved by adding some effects :
  • Damage scaling on weapon DPS, and not just on focus and lvl : this is the most obvious one - this way you can truly take advantage of a high DPS weapon
  • Adding %elemental damage, like +20% to fire damage. This is the only way to scale properly the flat damage skills. But beware, as this stat might be capped as well..
  • Adding %crit damage. Same as %elemental damage - do not work on Damage over Time though
  • Health stealing : health management is a major issue in T1. Even if you come with bags of rejuvenation potion, for some classes it's just not enough to survive
  • Damage Reflection : this is a very good mechanism to protect yourself from projectiles
  • %DR : well, actually since it is capped, and since all chars should have max DR, it only makes you be able to free some sockets..
  • Temporary Shield like Engineer's Forcefield, but scaling on another stat than just lvl

And these are the main existing effects that can be used to make your survival better. In my opinion, the worst classes are simply those who do not have enough of these effects.

But Miothan might have a different opinion on this - he is the one who has the most experience with Tier 1 and experiencing with the different classes
« Last Edit: October 29, 2015, 08:30:35 AM by potterman28wxcv »

Miothan

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Re: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2015, 01:52:56 PM »
Have made posts about both Paladin and Embermage on what/how to fix them being shit many months ago, but it's basically just a lack of viable abilities, they lack sustain abilities that ACTUALLY works and they also lack good spammable attacks.

Embermage alone has SO many shitabilities, don't really feel like writing up a whole post about it, i am sure my old post can be found here if you look where i pointed out what would be good changes for the Embermage and since nothing has changed since then, it's safe to say those changes would still make it better.

I'll see if i can find my old post when im back home later on, have to go help out with something now so don't have time to do much more than post this :P
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Miothan

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Re: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2015, 08:54:42 PM »
Found the Embermage discussion: http://forums.synergiesmod.com/index.php?topic=5066.15

The current T1 sets are fine, what needs balance is Embermages Abilities which just plainly sucks. Salan has mentioned several times that he balanced SynergiedMOD for Elite difficulty and didn't want stuff to be too easy, so it's really balanced atm, what isn't balanced are the shitty abilities on some classes.
What was once dead, can be made into servants of death and destruction. Feast on the innocent, slaughter the weak and punish those who would stand in your way!

Salan

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Re: Outlander and Ember Mage DPS Mod
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2015, 07:55:49 PM »
Found the Embermage discussion: http://forums.synergiesmod.com/index.php?topic=5066.15

The current T1 sets are fine, what needs balance is Embermages Abilities which just plainly sucks. Salan has mentioned several times that he balanced SynergiedMOD for Elite difficulty and didn't want stuff to be too easy, so it's really balanced atm, what isn't balanced are the shitty abilities on some classes.

ya i started to address this but hadn't really gotten through it all
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